Australian Donor Conception Forum

General Category => Searching for past donors => Topic started by: Quinny on February 23, 2007, 10:21:03 AM



Title: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on February 23, 2007, 10:21:03 AM
Hello,

I am searching for anyone who donated to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith (Perth, Western Australia), in particular in 1976. I was conceived in 1976 around September or October.
I have nothing to base a search on except that the donor will be caucasian and have a blood type of A or AB.
I spoke to Dr Douglas-Smith and he told me the donors he used were medical students who were "local boys".

I hope to be able to contact the donor and any half-siblings.

Cheers,
Adam


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Catalina on January 29, 2009, 01:03:41 AM
Hi there Adam,

I recently agreed to act as go-between/detective for a family friend in her mid-80's. She is looking for children who were the result of her late son Peter's donations. Peter was a medical student who donated to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith between 1973 and 1982.

What a coincidence to find your post on my first tentative search!

I would love to speak to you in more detail regarding Peter and any possible links to yourself.

Cheers,
Catalina


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on January 30, 2009, 01:06:13 AM
Hi Catalina,

Thankyou for your post.

It would be great to speak to you about Peter. Given that time frame he could be the donor for me or my sister (we have different donors).


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on February 13, 2009, 06:44:34 AM
Just to give a quick update on this.

There are a lot of commonalities between myself and this donor, Peter. I have seen a picture of him when he was 21 but I don't think he looks like me. There are still a lot of common attributes so I am hoping to progress to a Y-chromosome DNA test with the brother or father. I don't hold out hope though because it would seem far too easy for this first try to be the correct one, and plus I don't want to set myself up for disappointment. :)

A thought occurred to me that I am a bit surprised I hadn't thought of before. I suspect that donor samples were being transferred between different clinics/practices. So it's entirely possible that my donor (assuming it's not Peter) donated somewhere else. That just makes this whole search so much harder!


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: dadams on February 15, 2009, 09:46:01 PM
Hi Adam, do you have any evidence of sample transfer between clinics?
Would be interesting to know if it did occur in the 70's.

I never put much emphasis on having to look exactly like your donor. It is always far more complicated than that - not all kids look like either or both of their biological parents.
I understand the not wanting to get your hopes up but I'll have my fingers crossed for you.
Please let us know how it goes and if possible fill us in on what steps taken during testing (number of markers etc etc).


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on February 16, 2009, 08:06:21 AM
Thanks Damian. It's slow going at the moment. It's difficult to decide which testing company to use.

I don't have any evidence. It's just that Peter (the donor in this thread) donated to two places so I suspect at least these two people could have been sharing samples. I asked a guy I know who was a donor doctor but he wasn't doing that in the 70's and 80's so he isn't sure but he said he wouldn't be surprised.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Daven on February 16, 2009, 11:27:05 AM
.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on April 01, 2009, 07:33:15 AM
Finally the DNA samples have been sent off for analysis. Now I should have results in a week or two.

The type of test being done is a Grandmother/grandson test with my Mum's DNA too.

This type of test is not as reliable as a Y-chromosome test but the grandmother wants to be tested first before she mentions anything to her husband. This is all I could go with. Still, most DNA test companies say that they can get a good result with all three of our samples, so who knows what will happen.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: dadams on April 01, 2009, 09:49:49 PM
Good luck Adam,
I hope you will post your results either way (if you are comfortable with doing so of course).
And especially include the technical components - while maybe not everyone will understand them fully it might be beneficial for other to see what happens and what results are returned.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on April 14, 2009, 12:23:39 PM
Hello,

I got the results today and it shows only a 10% chance of there being a relationship. While that seems low I am not convinced that this number is representative of what the chances really are. Perhaps someone (dadams?) could shed some light into the results and why they put 10% as the chance.

Here are the details with explanation below:

Results: This test was performed by an ISO17025, AABB and CAP accredited laboratory.

Interpretation: The result of the Combined First Order Index can be used in the following manner to interpret the results: If the number is less than 1, it is unlikely (<50%) that a biological relationship exits between the individuals tested. If the number listed is equal to 1, then a 50% probability exits that they are biologically related. As the number increases, so does the percentage probability of a relationship. When the number reaches 100, the tested relationship is highly probable, practically proven.

Based on the DNA Analysis, the value of the Combined First Order Index of 0.12 is less than 1 and the Probability of Relationship is 10.7142% indicating that it is unlikely that a biological relationship exists between the individuals tested.

System     Known Parent     GRANDCHILD    GRANDPARENT      Index
AMEL               XX              XY              XX
D3S1358    16      18      15      18              18      0.5
TH01        7       9       6       7       6       7      1.632
D21S11     29      30      29      30              30      1.536
D18S51     13      14      13      17      16      17      2.123
Penta E    12      13      11      12      12      14      0.5
D5S818     11      12      11      13              11      0.5
D13S317    11      13       9      11       8      11      0.5
D7S820      8      10              10              10      2.073
D16S539    10      12      10      12      12      13      1.071
CSF1PO      8      11      11      12      10      13      0.5
Penta D    11      13      11      13      11      12      1.199
vWA                17      15      17              16      0.5
D8S1179    13      14              13              13      2.078
TPOX                8       8      11       8      10      0.5
FGA        22      26      19      26      20      22      0.5

Combined First Order Index: 0.12 Probability of Relationship: 10.7142%

In the result, you can also see that the DNA test report will show on the left hand column each of the 16 loci analysed. Every person carries 2 copies of a chromosome, one which he inherits from the biological father and the other from the mother. For each loci, 2 numbers are shown (or one in the case where the alleles are identical (homozygous)) representing the size of the allele. These numbers are then used to compare between the persons involved in the testing to see whether they match or not.

Therefore, if the child tested has 2 alleles labelled as 15 and 18, and the mother has two alleles labelled 15 and 17, then the child will have inherited the 15 allele from the mother and the allele 18 from the biological father. Once the test is completed, the analysis will check to confirm if the alleged father has this particulalr allele, and of course to be the biological father the allele must match. The procedure is performed for each loci tested. If the alleged father does not have the matching allele at every locus tested, then he cannot be confirmed as the biological parent.

In the case where there are mutiple exclusions, then then Probability of Paternity percentage is 0% - thereby confirming that the the DNA of the alleged father is not consistent with that of the child and therefore he is excluded as the biological father. If the probability Percentage is consistent, then a result in excess of 99.9%+ is normally obtained.

For your information, we also would like to point out that :

- although we state 16 loci, one of the actual loci tested (called Amelogenin) is analysed to confirm the actual sex of the person. The CPI analysis is therefore based on 15 loci. See article 'The Amelogenin Gene in DNA Testing' for more information.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: dadams on April 14, 2009, 11:13:23 PM
Hi Adam
an index of 0.12 is very low. So for my mind there is very little chance of you being related.
The problem with a test of this sort (testing one grandparent is that it is not very accurate because they are not the person above you in the tree so to speak). Maybe it would have been helpful to test both grandparents and I wonder if the company would believe that that would be helpful also.
The reason I say this is that it is possible (but less probable) that their son when passing on to his donated children, donated alleles from his father (you had the possible grandmother tested). And if that was the case then you would come back with a low index score. If you have excellent evidence that everything else fits (blood group etc etc) it may be something worth considering (testing the garndfather that is), but I would not want to get your hopes up about the chances, but as I said it all depends on which of the alleles he got from his parents that he has then passed on.
The Combined First Order Index Score is the result of the probabilty of each allele multiplied by each other (eg 0.5 x 1.632 x etc etc).
Thankyou very much for sharing, it is extremely interesting.
If you have any specific questions you can always PM me.
Cheers mate.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on April 15, 2009, 12:12:35 AM
I had to clarify the results with the testing company, so I have updated the original post of results.
dadams, what you said is how I thought to interpret the results. Thankyou.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on May 18, 2009, 06:12:54 AM
I had a look through pages and pages of Medical Student photos in the UWA Archives today. None of them stood out, but one did for my wife. I wrote down a few names so I'll see what I can find out.

I also know that there are two doctors at the local medical centre who went to UWA at about the right time. I don't think they are my donor but they may be able to help with some information.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: dadams on May 18, 2009, 10:22:59 AM
Fathers don't always look like their offspring so it is a bit hard to put too much emphasis on looks.
There was one story Leonie was telling about a DCSG meeting where she and other believed that one of the donors there was the father of one of the offspring. As it turned out it was another man who was also there but everyone thought would not be the father.
It is certainly interesting going through the books looking.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on May 18, 2009, 04:54:59 PM
Thanks for that Damian. That would make it so much harder. :) I was looking for resemblences for Bundygrrrl and my sister but I don't think I was supplied with photos after 1980 so their donors probably weren't in the range I saw.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on June 18, 2009, 11:50:37 PM
I know a couple of the doctors at our local medical centre went to UWA at about the time when my donor would have been there (assuming what I have been told is true, anyway).

Yesterday my wife spoke to one and he said he remembered someone coming in at the start of a lecture asking for sperm donors and that he is not a sperm donor.

I find it interesting that this was how they recruited. I wonder how many other classes they went to.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: dadams on June 20, 2009, 05:53:12 AM
Interesting. I am aware that some during their obgyn component were pressured to donate as part of the "program".


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on January 19, 2011, 06:39:31 AM
Bundygrrrl and I went to the UWA Archives today and looked through lots and lots of photos. We took down some names and took some photos of photos but I don't feel very positive about it all. Bundygrrrl may have more luck as she seemed to think one guy in particular stood out to her as a match for her brother (which should also be a match for her).

I am impressed that anyone can use this method (looking through photos of uni students) to find their donor. I find it quite frustrating.




Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: dadams on January 20, 2011, 10:39:29 AM
It is extremely time consuming and taxing mentally.
Sometimes the one you think looks least like you is in fact the one who is related. It has happened before. We often put a lot of stock in trying to find facial recognition, it can be a good guide but is not necessarily the be all and end all.
It is good that you can have a look at photos. It is certainly worth a try.
I have no photo records to look at just a list of many hundreds of names of graduates.
i wish you both luck.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: bev on February 17, 2011, 09:29:59 AM
I ahve only just read this thread
I was at a conference last year and during a teabreak I was out in the main foyer and overheard someone (possibly a doctor? - I think attending a gynaecology conference runnng in the next hall, had a different coloured name badge cord!) saying that they used to swap donor sperm between Melbourne and Adelaide, so certainly possible that there was sharing between clinics in WA.
I tried to eavesdrop more but there was a lot of background noise and I didn't want to be too obvious - sorry can't give more details
Cheers, Bev


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on February 17, 2011, 01:24:42 PM
Thanks for that Bev. Very interesting.

I still only have the donor doctor to go on as saying he used "local boys" from the university.
I do understand now that that may include men who donated to other clinics, now that makes it even harder to find someone.
Given that only one person has responded to "Douglas-Smith" being the doctor I am not sure that any are really interested in finding out.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: dadams on February 18, 2011, 12:28:36 AM
Thanks for sharing that info Bev, just highlights the need for consistent legislation and uniform rights particularly seeing SA and Vic couldn't be more diametrically opposed with legislation a few years ago.


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: kfraser on December 17, 2011, 02:52:56 PM
Hi there,
Did you ever have any luck? I'm hearing more and more about sperm being 'shared' around Australia so am just hoping for something.
I was conceived in Brisbane in 1981 and have B+ blood type, light blue eyes and brown hair, fair complexion.
Let me know if you want to talk more.
Kerri
0430 781 917


Title: Re: Search for donors to Dr Colin Douglas-Smith
Post by: Quinny on December 19, 2011, 12:17:37 AM
Hi Kerri,

I don't know if any was passed around Australia at that time. My sister has B type blood (not sure if positive or negative) and she was conceived in 1980. Her eyes are brown though.